The ultimate guide to product building with the man who changed software

September 9, 2024

AI Summary

5 min read

Jason Fried, co-founder of 37signals and creator of Basecamp, came to the podcast with a specific challenge: he shared a raw, unpolished product idea he has been sitting on for years, one he admits he does not even fully like because it is ad-based. The idea is a daily scratch-off app. Once a day, at a set global time, users open the app to find a full-screen ad printed on a gray, scratch-off substrate. They must physically scratch the screen with a finger, then blow into the microphone to clear the "dust." Behind the ad, a small percentage of users—capped at five percent—win a prize from the sponsoring advertiser, like a coupon or a discount. The rest get nothing. The ad is the product. The mystery and the low-odds reward are the draw. Fried admits he finds the idea "ugly" because it is ad-based, but he cannot shake it because it is so simple and potentially massive: a daily, global, shared moment where the only thing to do is scratch, blow, and see if you won.

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What you'll learn

1 (00:04) **The Core Idea: Ads as the Product** - Jason Fried introduces a provocative concept: making ads themselves the product, not an interruption.
2 (08:58) **Why This Could Be Huge** - Greg and Jason discuss the potential scale and business model of the scratch-off ad app.
3 (12:30) **The "Daily Internet Experience" Concept** - Jason shares a related idea for a scheduled, ephemeral web experience.
4 (14:49) **The Power of "Opening Hours" for Software** - The conversation shifts to a core design philosophy: adding scarcity and real-time constraints to digital products.
5 (18:51) **The Shower Door Sketching App** - Jason pitches a second, more personal idea: a digital simulation of drawing on a steamy shower door.
6 (23:49) **The "Naples vs. Domino's" Standard** - Jason explains why a simple idea like the shower door app is deceptively hard to execute well.
7 (27:05) **Marketing Philosophy: Build Something That Markets Itself** - Jason reveals his approach to distribution and product development.

+ Full timestamped outline available in the app

Show Notes

I’m joined by Jason Fried, Co-founder and CEO of 37signals, as we deep dive on innovative startup ideas, our frameworks to building products people love, and our thoughts on the current software landscape.

1) The "Scratch-off Ad" app idea:
• Full-screen ad you scratch off with your finger
• Blow into mic to clear "dust"
• Chance to win prizes/coupons
• Global, once-a-day experience
Potential: Massive user base, high engagement

2) "Shower Door Sketch" app concept:
• Simulates drawing on steamy shower glass
• Ephemeral canvas that fogs up & clears
• Add shower sounds for immersion
• Screenshot to save ideas
Perfect for creative brainstorming!

3) Key insight: Bring real-world experiences to digital
• Leverage mystery, surprise, uncertainty
• Create moments that can't be replicated
• Tap into universal human experiences
"There's some sort of deeper universal things to tap into here." - Jason

4) The power of limitations in software:
• Time-based experiences (HQ Trivia)
• Visit-once websites
• Apps with "open hours"
Creates scarcity & increases perceived value

5) Hobbyist ethos missing in modern software:
• Early internet had more quirky, fun projects
• Less focus on monetization, more on exploration
• Need for "weirder" apps and experiences
Challenge: How can we make the internet weird again?

6) Cozy software movement:
• Make apps feel warm, comfortable
• Contrast to clinical, cold modern design
• Focus on user experience & delight
Goal: Create software people genuinely enjoy using

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37signals: https://37signals.com/

Episode Timestamps:
0:00 Intro
02:17 Startup Idea 1: The "Scratch-off Ad" app
18:44 Startup Idea 2: "Shower Door Sketch" app concept:
33:43 Frameworks for building products people love