12 UFOs at Lockheed? Unpacking Jay Stratton’s Claims

October 16, 2026

AI Summary

5 min read

Jay Stratton, the highest-ranking civilian ever to lead the U.S. government’s UAP investigation efforts, claims in his new memoir Out of the Shadows that Lockheed Martin once held an inventory of twelve recovered craft of non-human origin. The figure comes from a conversation Stratton says he had around 2009 with a man named Jim Ryder, a former Lockheed employee who worked directly under the legendary Ben Rich. Stratton says the number was independently corroborated by two other well-known figures in the field, Eric Davis and Hal Puthoff. But the claim is just one piece of a book that has landed with a complicated thud in the UFO community—praised by some as a bombshell, dismissed by others as old news, and scrutinized by many for what it leaves out.

The Book’s Core Claims and Their Sources

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What you'll learn

1 Timestamped Outline
2 (02:14) **Opening & Breaking News** - Host Andy welcomes Pavel, then reads a statement from Mark Christopher Lee about a Trump UFO disclosure window
3 (06:09) **High-Level First Impressions of Stratton's Book** - Pavel and Andy share their initial reactions to "Out of the Shadows"
4 (10:42) **Comparing Stratton to Other Whistleblowers** - The hosts discuss how Stratton's book fits alongside Elizondo's and Grusch's accounts
5 (14:56) **Reactions Split Across the Community** - Andy describes the three camps of reader reactions to the book
6 (21:47) **The Friction Between Avi Loeb and the Stratton Circle** - A detailed account of tensions at Phenomicon between Avi Loeb, Jay Stratton, and Micah Hanks
7 (26:55) **The Lockheed 12-Craft Claim** - The standout headline: Stratton says Jim Ryder told him Lockheed had 12 recovered non-human craft around 2009

+ Full timestamped outline available in the app

Guests on this episode

Jay Stratton

Show Notes

In a special midweek show, I’m joined by Pavel to dig into Jay Stratton’s new book, Out of the Shadows. Does it move the UFO conversation forward, or leave us with more claims than answers?

We discuss:

• Claims that Lockheed held 12 recovered non-human craft and that reverse engineering had succeeded.
• Accounts of recovered beings and the questions these stories leave unanswered.
• Stratton’s personal encounters and what he means by seeing non-human intelligence firsthand.
• His criticism of Sean Kirkpatrick and warnings about manufactured whistleblowers.
• Where his account fits alongside David Grusch and Lue Elizondo, including questions over AATIP’s history.

We also look at Stratton’s television interviews, the divided reaction to the book, and why distinguishing personal experience, professional knowledge and secondhand accounts matters.

What deserves serious follow-up, what needs evidence, and what should Stratton be asked next?

Contains spoilers for Out of the Shadows.

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