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5 min readFighting with Fox News feat. Jessica Tarlov
Jessica Tarlov, a Democratic strategist and co-host of Fox News's The Five, has spent years learning how to argue effectively with people who disagree with her fundamentally. In conversation with Tommy Vietor, she breaks down the psychological principles and practical techniques behind her approach—lessons drawn from her daily experience as the liberal voice on the most-watched cable news show, and now the subject of her book I Disagree: Winning Arguments Without Losing Friends.
The psychology of arguing across divides
Tarlov's central insight is that most conservatives she works with simply do not treat politics as a life-or-death identity the way many liberals do. "That has been a big lesson for me to learn intellectually, but also to feel it," she says. During commercial breaks on The Five, co-hosts can pivot instantly from a tense debate about policy to light conversation about sports or family. The disagreement does not carry over. This dynamic puts the burden on Tarlov to decide what the relationship will look like—and she has chosen to invest in those friendships deliberately.
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What you'll learn
- 1 (03:44) **The Job: What It’s Like to Be a Democrat on Fox News** - Jessica Tarlov describes her daily prep routine for *The Five*, including how she uses her own podcast to audition arguments and doom-scrolls right-wing sources to anticipate attacks.
- 2 (09:58) **Surprising Friendships and a Roger Ailes Lesson** - Tarlov reveals her close friendship with Greg Gutfeld and a bizarrely kind one-on-one meeting with Roger Ailes.
- 3 (12:10) **Why the Fox Audience Isn’t All MAGA** - Tarlov pushes back on the assumption that Fox viewers are a monolith, explaining that the network’s workforce and audience are more diverse than critics assume.
- 4 (16:12) **Handling Trump’s Attacks: Style vs. Substance** - Tarlov discusses how she processes criticism from Donald Trump, who has mocked her appearance and called her a “big dummy” online.
- 5 (25:10) **The Truth About “Fighter” Politics** - Tarlov and Tommy debate whether the “fighter” mode that excites partisans actually turns off swing voters.
- 6 (33:55) **Should Democrats Go on Fox News?** - A full debate on whether a 2028 primary candidate should appear on Fox before securing the nomination.
- 7 (43:50) **Abdul El-Sayed’s Fox Interview: A Case Study** - Tarlov and Tommy analyze the viral interview where Abdul El-Sayed sparred with Jesse Waters over trans issues and circumcision.
+ Full timestamped outline available in the app
Guests on this episode
Show Notes
Fox News host Jessica Tarlov, the lone liberal voice on "The Five," stops by the studio to talk to Tommy about her new book "I Disagree: Winning Arguments without Losing Friends." Tarlov offers Tommy a behind the scenes look into the making of Fox's most combative show and her relationships off-screen with her conservative colleagues.
She also talks about how she handles criticism from Fox News's most infamous viewer, what it's like watching her former colleagues serve in the President's cabinet, and why she thinks Democrats need to spend more time on Fox News in 2028.
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