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The relationship between Torah and the State of Israel has always been complicated. Israel is the Jewish state, but what exactly does that mean? Should Torah shape public policy? Should religious values be advanced through legislation? Should the government strengthen religious institutions, or does political power inevitably come at a spiritual cost?

These questions are not theoretical. Over the past week, they became front-page news.

Over the course of just a few days, the Knesset passed a Basic Law declaring Torah study to be a fundamental value of the State of Israel. It approved legislation restoring and even expanding the Chief Rabbinate's monopoly over kashrut certification. It passed a law temporarily preventing the arrest of yeshiva students who have not reported for military service. At the same time, the Bnei Brak municipality officially sanctioned two gender-separated public streets. Each of these developments raises its own questions. Taken together, however, they point to something much larger: What kind of Jewish state are we trying to build?

To discuss these issues, I invited Rabbi David Stav back onto the podcast. Rabbi Stav has spent decades thinking about the relationship between halacha, the Chief Rabbinate, Israeli democracy, and the role of religion in the public sphere. He was also a candidate for Chief Rabbi, giving him a unique perspective on these questions.

Our conversation ranges widely. We discuss the new Basic Law and why Rabbi Stav believes it is not a victory for Torah but, rather, a misuse of Torah. We talk about military service and whether Torah learning can exempt someone from sharing the burden of national defense. We examine the renewed centralization of kashrut under the Chief Rabbinate, the proper relationship between religion and state, whether Israel should legislate religious observance at all, and why Rabbi Stav believes that coercion often weakens rather than strengthens Judaism.

Finally, we consider the future. At a time when many Religious Zionists feel politically homeless, can Torah once again become the inheritance of the entire Jewish people rather than the possession of any single political camp? And if so, what would it take to get there?

This is a timely conversation, but I believe its importance extends far beyond this week's headlines. It addresses some of the most fundamental questions about the future of Torah, the future of Israel, and the future of the relationship between them.

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