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Rethinking Depression

March 16, 2026

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5 min read

Rethinking Depression

For centuries, physicians treated fever as a dangerous disease—an enemy to be crushed. Patients were bled, purged, packed in ice, or wrapped in vinegar-soaked sheets. It wasn't until the late 19th century that scientists recognized fever not as a disease but as the body's immune response. Moderate fever helps fight infection. What looked like a malfunction was actually a sign of the body's vitality.

Psychologist Jonathan Rottenberg of Cornell University asks whether the same might be true of depression.

A Personal Descent

Rottenberg's interest is not academic. Thirty years ago, he was a confident PhD student in history at Johns Hopkins, about to get married, feeling like the smartest person in the room. Then his body began sending strange signals: pain on his left side, physical weakness, a flu-like fatigue that wouldn't lift. His ability to concentrate collapsed. "I can look at a page and I see the words and my ability to concentrate is getting to be close to zero," he recalls. He spent large parts of the day lying on the ground.

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What you'll learn

  • 1 (00:00) **Fever as a Metaphor for Depression** - Shankar opens with the historical shift in understanding fever, from a disease to a sign of the body's immune response, as a parallel for rethinking depression.
  • 2 (02:12) **Introducing the Thesis** - Shankar proposes that depression may have roots in our drive to survive and flourish, not just a malfunction.
  • 3 (04:19) **Content Warning and Crisis Resources** - A note about discussion of suicide and a resource for help.
  • 4 (04:41) **Guest Introduction: John Rottenberg's Personal Story** - Shankar introduces psychologist John Rottenberg, who challenges the defect model of depression, beginning with his own severe depressive episode.
  • 5 (12:49) **The Long Road to Recovery** - Rottenberg describes his four-year depression and how studying psychology became his path to recovery.
  • 6 (16:06) **Challenging the "Defect Model" of Depression** - Rottenberg critiques the prevailing view that depression is a fundamental defect inside the person.
  • 7 (20:53) **Depression as an Evolved Adaptation** - Rottenberg argues that the capacity for low mood is an evolved, functional mechanism, not a flaw.

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Show Notes

We tend to see depression as an illness to eliminate, evidence that something has gone wrong in the brain. But what if low mood serves a purpose? Psychologist Jonathan Rottenberg examines the evolutionary roots of depression and reflects on his own painful experience with suicidal despair. He explores how depression can narrow our focus, and sometimes open the door to change.

A note that this story includes a discussion of suicide. If you or someone you love is struggling with thoughts of suicide, there are people who can help. If you're inside the U.S., call or text 988, or visit the 988 Helpline online. If you’re outside the U.S., you can search for resources in your country on this site.

Episode illustration by Runend Art for Unsplash


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