AI Summary
5 min readHow Real is Race? A Conversation on Biology, Morality, and Intelligence
In this episode of the DarkHorse Podcast, biologist Bret Weinstein and philosopher of biology Dr. Nathan Cofnas engage in a rigorous, collegial debate about race realism, the nature of moral truth, and the genetic basis of cognitive differences between populations. Cofnas describes himself as a "race realist" in two senses: he believes racial categories have a basis in biological fact, and he believes there are meaningful differences in socially relevant traits between racial groups. Weinstein pushes back on the framing while agreeing that population-level differences are real and worth studying.
The Problem with "Race Realism"
Weinstein objects to the term "race realism" itself, arguing it smuggles in a conclusion before the evidence is in. "To call yourselves the realists when someone else is open to that which is empirically studiable and falsifiable is effectively to put your thumb on the scales of scientific validation," he says. Cofnas counters that in philosophy, "realism" simply means believing something exists — it doesn't settle whether the belief is correct.
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What you'll learn
- 1 (00:00) **Opening & Guest Introduction** - Bret introduces Dr. Nathan Cofnas, a philosopher of biology, and the context of his recent expose on Jason Arday at Cambridge.
- 2 (03:43) **Defining Race Realism** - Cofnas explains the term has two meanings: biological classification and differences in socially relevant traits between races.
- 3 (07:54) **Race vs. Population & Lineage** - Bret argues race is a politically degraded term for real biological phenomena like lineage and population.
- 4 (13:58) **The Euphemism Treadmill** - Cofnas argues replacing "race" with "population" won't work because the stigma will follow the new term.
- 5 (16:39) **Moral Realism & Objective Morality** - Cofnas states he is not a moral realist; morals are based on human interests and evolutionary dynamics, not mind-independent facts.
- 6 (21:59) **Moral Rules & Natural Selection** - Bret argues that moral rules that survive natural selection are "true" in a practical sense, using the "crying wolf" story as an example.
- 7 (24:54) **The Westermarck Effect: Mechanism vs. Myth** - Bret presents the standard story: the Westermarck effect is a genetic mechanism to avoid incest by making childhood co-residents sexually averse.
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Guests on this episode
Show Notes
Bret Weinstein speaks with philosopher of biology Nathan Cofnas on the subject of race realism and the implications of genetic differences among populations.
Find Nathan Cofnas on X at https://x.com/nathancofnas and on Substack at https://ncofnas.com.
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Music: "Marble Machine" by Wintergatan
This track can be downloaded for free at www.wintergatan.net
Free License to use this track in your video can be downloaded at www.wintergatan.net
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Mentioned in this episode:
DEI Fraud and Cover-Up at Cambridge https://ncofnas.com/p/dei-fraud-and-cover-up-at-cambridge
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Tiemstamps:
00:00:00 The Rules of Engagement
00:03:46 Race Realist?
00:08:47 Lineage vs. Race
00:13:58 The Euphemism Treadmill
00:16:38 Is Morality Real?
00:24:51 Westermarck and the Kibbutz
00:35:34 The Incest Taboo Test
00:41:53 Where Moral Beliefs Come From
00:52:34 Wokeism as an Existential Threat
00:57:54 Darwinism Applied to Humans
01:02:21 Does Winter Make You Smarter?
01:07:53 Inuits and Ethiopians
01:10:46 Why Aren't We All Von Neumann?
01:18:10 What About West African Sprinters?
01:24:37 The Black Cats in the Dark
01:28:21 The Longest Childhood on Earth
01:35:07 Everything Is an IQ Test
01:40:59 What Slavery Broke
01:45:21 Ethiopia, Korea, Japan, China
01:49:32 The Second Mode of Inheritance
01:54:18 What We Actually Disagree About
01:57:47 The Arms Race Has No Ceiling
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